Nitrogen inflation and TPMS

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Scalded Cat
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Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 11:45 am

Post by Scalded Cat »

I am considering a Ni fill for my current car and wondered if anyone has experience with this and the TPMS ? AWD V8 specd in the negotiation phase now, given Autocar article of recent regarding SVR F Type Coupe for the LA Show, this may be somewhat premature but thought the NI and TPMS question worth asking.

Jagalot
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Post by Jagalot »

No experience with the Jag but from a previous life I have known Lotus Evora owners having a problem.
Scalded Cat
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Post by Scalded Cat »

Thanks for the info. Jagalot
ambrazul
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Post by ambrazul »

Complete was of money had it done on my Aston but tyres still lost pressure then I had to put in air
shakin_lee
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Post by shakin_lee »

I currently use Nitrogen in my V6S Coupe and have not found any issues. On the plus side my tire pressures have been more stable and therefore not required contact topping up.
I did the same with my previous car a C63 amg which is notoriously hard on rear tyres and got 10,000 -12,000 miles. I also had my wheel alignment done once a year which also helped.
ronniet
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Post by ronniet »

Major reason why nitrogen fails is that all of the air in the tyre isn't removed fully and or the nitrogen itself is slightly contaminated with air
Millwheel
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Post by Millwheel »

Air is (mostly) nitrogen and oxygen. Atmospheric air also contains water vapour. Oxygen diffuses through the tyre casing faster than nitrogen so removing the oxygen means that the pressure in the tyre drops slightly slower over time. Slightly. Temperature effects are far more pronounced. Nitrogen is inert for all practical purposes. Oxygen under pressure, especially if combined with water vapour, is corrosive if the water vapour condenses. I’ve not seen an alloy wheel with internal corrosion for many years, and the TPMS will be suitably sealed. Applications where maintaining a fixed pressure is critical (racing cars, aircraft, construction equipment) may benefit from the reduced pressure adjustment frequency resulting from nitrogen fill. For the rest of us, just checking the tyre pressure and topping up/bleeding off with air as the ambient temperature changes (and do it on shaded tyres, not tyres soaking up direct solar energy) must surely be perfectly adequate, especially as we can read pressures in the car. There might be a case for using the heavier inert gases such as argon which could possibly offer some convective heat transmission effects but this is esoteric stuff for anything but world speed record attempts.

The most important thing is just to have the right tyre pressure for the conditions on the day. What’s in the tyre is pretty irrelevant, so long as it remains a mostly inert compressible gas; chlorine is likely to be a bad idea . A liquid might be interesting but wouldn’t do much for unsprung weight and ride might be, well, a little harsh, though I’d like to try a freon or similar gas that liquefies at low pressure, just to see what happens. Could even use propane but the flammability is a bit of an issue.

The whole discussion will soon be academic anyway as we move to airless tyres like the Michelin UPTIS which is due on the market in 2024.
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RPSN
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Post by RPSN »

I was recently looking at nitrogen inflation and noticed that ATS charges £2 per tyre for this!

I was put off by the following information on their website.... https://www.atseuromaster.co.uk/consume ... 030314item

“Once you have nitrogen in your tyres, ideally you should keep the pressure topped up using nitrogen to a minimum of 95%. If you need to top up using compressed air, this is fine but it will dilute the nitrogen content in the tyres.”

“In order to get the optimum performance from your tyres, the nitrogen content in your tyres should be above 95%.”

I check my tyre pressures regularly and it’s not very often that they need inflating. I’ll be sticking to my normal method of inflating the tyres with a digital tyre inflator via the centre console plug in socket (I use the one in the cubby box). Once done, I do a further check with a separate digital tyre pressure gauge which is very accurate and corresponds with the tyre pressure figures which can be accessed via the instrument panel 'Vehicle Information' menu.
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cj10jeeper
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Post by cj10jeeper »

Seems a total waste of time to me when air is already 78% nitrogen and onsite generation gets you typically to 95% (theoretical 99%, but everything needs to be right and I cannot imagine that in a tyre shop :( )
Even assuming the supply was pure (100%) to start with, the tyres already have air in them, let's say 10% of final inflated volume, so inflating with nitrogen may also get you to 90%.
Combine the above and I doubt as you drive out of a tyre shop you have more than 85% nitrogen, so paying £8 for and incremental 7% nitrogen.

If it's offered free at a tyre change then fine by me, but I'll keep my £8 for a few litres of premium fuel

Note that this is a tongue in cheek look at selling snake oil, but if anyone is expert enough to run the whole thing through Boyle's law and Charles' law or combined gas law, I'll be delighted to read it
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JasonL
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Post by JasonL »

Its very beneficial if you track a car. It keep's a more stable pressure than air during hot and cold cycle's. Not a huge benefit for normal road driving though other than it will be less likely to leak due to the molecule sizing.
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